Lethal force to protect property?

tonyccw · Post by **tonyccw** » Wed May 07, 2003 1:23 am

J-man: That's 2 things Canada have over NYC. The semi-auto included non-traditional rifles, like the Ruger Mini-14 (which I had to sell). As for CCW's for handguns, I have a better chance of winning the lottery than getting the NYPD to issue me one.

J-man · Post by **J-man** » Wed May 07, 2003 8:06 pm

tonyccw wrote:J-man: That's 2 things Canada have over NYC. The semi-auto included non-traditional rifles, like the Ruger Mini-14 (which I had to sell). As for CCW's for handguns, I have a better chance of winning the lottery than getting the NYPD to issue me one.

Get into the upper tax class and you'll have no problem. (take a look at who they issue them too)

Falcon, why thank you...

tonyccw · Post by **tonyccw** » Thu May 08, 2003 11:51 pm

J-man wrote:Get into the upper tax class and you'll have no problem. (take a look at who they issue them too)

It's not just the money. Lot's of rich people gets denied as well. You need connections in the Gov't. FOTM (Friends of the Mayor), and FOTC (Friends of the Commissioner) are the ones that gets issued CCW's in NYC.

bigfifty · Post by **bigfifty** » Sun Sep 07, 2003 8:07 pm

When I lived in N.M. went to the local sheriff's office and inquired about laws and attitudes toward the criminal types. He said, I quote- " Son you are in the West now. Anybody that is in your house without your permission, you can shoot". I do think that anyone that breaks into your home has demonstrated that they are not 'reasonable' and do not play by the rules. So I do not believe that I have to be reasonable back. Killing someone over 'stuff' is a little more 'extreme' than defence of life. But as my wife says- "We work damn hard to make money so that we are able to have nice things. Let them do the same". Just a thought. Take care. Bigfifty

Post by **jim d,** » Sun Sep 07, 2003 8:28 pm

bigfifty,

That perspective is not confined to the West. In North Carolina where I live, you can shoot an intruder. There are some limitations to shooting those who intrude. A police officer once told me that the courts have not been particularly friendly to homeowners who shoot people in the back dozens of yards from the house. I can live with that.

Jim

Bonzo · Post by **Bonzo** » Sun Sep 07, 2003 8:40 pm

Mr. Jim D,

I once knew a liquor store owner that had 2 confirmed kills in seperate incidents at his store. The last one made it to the door when he was felled with a shot to the back and died in the parking lot. The local DA? Justifiable self defense. If your gonna do the crime, be prepared to suffer the consequence.

Best Regard's,

Bonz

Post by **jim d,** » Sun Sep 07, 2003 9:02 pm

Bonz,

I agree with the DA, and can envision many circumstances where the criminal could legitimately take a bullet to the back. The point that the cop was making was more along the lines of shooting a burglar on the run away from you, as opposed to shooting a robber who is threatening you. I should note that the officer didn't say that the courts would definately rule any one way, but that dropping someone many yards from your house who was running away would require a bit of an explanation.

Jim

Teddy · Post by **Teddy** » Sun Sep 07, 2003 9:20 pm

If he was carrying anything of mine that I valued.... I'd shoot him anyway!

I've got no time for thieves...

Best wishes
Teddy

missaman · Post by **missaman** » Sun Sep 07, 2003 9:53 pm

Missaman did not come from a privileged family i saw my dad work with cardboard in the soles of his shoes. Nobody is entitled to anything i own.I worked my way thru college. some of the crappy jobs taring foundations, digging ditches etc. my dad became an electrical engineer who designed the guidance systems for the r.p.v's used in the gulf war. i became a project manager for a large const. co. you want my stuff?? You pay with your life!
No lost sleep
Missaman in da hood

the spotlight kid · Post by **the spotlight kid** » Sun Sep 07, 2003 10:23 pm

If anyone breaks into my place while I am here,they will be sorry!If anyone on the street tries to kick the shit out of me,I take that as a threat upon my life,as I have a heart condition,and reserve the right to protect myself no matter how!I would rather do time for killing some arsehole than be laying in the gutter!This side of the pond you are not encouraged to defend yourself,I say ANYONE who invades my house or my space with the wrong intentions will find someone who WILL fight to the death to protect whats mine! I hate F***ing thieves! I hate F***ing arseholes! I am lucky where I live I get respect from the local scumbags and I'm good friends with the local Skinhead crowd,(something that I could never have forseen!)

but that comes with living in a city for 30 years.If I lived your side of the pond,I would be armed to the teeth and shoot any C**t that gets in my way!

Cheers the spotlightkid.

Pushbutton · Post by **Pushbutton** » Sun Sep 07, 2003 10:31 pm

Spot lights answer seems the best so far so I'll go with that one Alex. You know you shouldn't tell people you have a heart condition like most of us geezers on here that still are doing the things you gave up years ago.Lou Reed I think. But anyway spotlight what if someone that didn't like you dressed as a rotting old blues player from the dead say Muddy Waters for instance and chased you and you dropped dead of fear. Better yet what if it was those Paint or Platter dancers you watched

PB

the spotlight kid · Post by **the spotlight kid** » Sun Sep 07, 2003 10:43 pm

Mr.P.B. I am used to seeing things like that,AND WORSE, on a regular basis!

Who said I'd given up ALL my vices!

I am only half the man I used to be,BUT,I can still leave these kids standing when it comes to CLASS! And their girlfriends know it!

I embarrassingly,got called an Icon tonight.I didn't mind though,as she was rather cute!

Cheers the spotlight kid.

Post by **jim d,** » Sun Sep 07, 2003 11:23 pm

missaman,

I can relate and am with you on this one. But be careful, my family (and my wife's), as well as many friends of mine live in your state. It is not one that I would prefer to have to go to court in if I shot someone for reasons that we would agree are justifiable. As you know, certain counties would be better than others, but yours (if my guess as to which one it is is right) could present a challenge.

Jim

Post by **tr4252** » Mon Sep 08, 2003 10:03 pm

About 30 years ago (I'm 52) I worked on a narcotics squad, undercover, and learned some things from the older guys that would be useful to all those here. If certain things are implied and not expressed, I do it because I think you're all smart enough to figure things out on your own. Here's a checklist of items which will get you back to the family in the shortest time, after the incident is over and your gun's been impounded, etc.
1. The perpetrator should be armed with a weapon himself/herself, the deadlier the better.
2. Your being prevented from escaping the premesis rather than fighting is a point in your favor too, will add credibility to your claim that the use of deadly physical force was your only option.
3. Evidence of forced entry is also a strong indication that you've been victimized rather than overly aggressive in your defense.
4. Evidence of bodily harm inflicted by the perpetrator on your person is a persuasive indicator of his/her intent.
5. Your lawyer should be at least twice as good as the perpetrators familys, friends, civil liberties group, etc.
Though it need not be said, I'll say it anyway; be sure of your target, your weapon, and yourself. Think in terms of the hairbag's motive, means, and opportunity. Deport yourself as a law abiding citizen who was forced to make a life-changing decision on the spot, under pressure.
My own opinion is that property is not worth the burden of taking another persons life, no matter how worthless it is. It will change you, and not for the better. Personal defense (you, your family, innocent bystanders) would be the only justification.
TR

the spotlight kid · Post by **the spotlight kid** » Mon Sep 08, 2003 11:37 pm

A slight tangent to this thread,An 81 year old lady was beaten to the ground in a nearby town to me.She was robbed of £15,but more importantly, her freedom to come and go as she pleases has gone.She will recover from her broken hip but her life has been stolen by some shit.It was on the local news that some arsehole aged about 18 was being sought.They featured an interview with her son whom I recognised as the main man who leads the West Ham Inter City Firm of Skinhead football hooligans.Just about the Nastiest bunch you could ever dread to meet.I was pleased to find out in my local tonight that there is a price on this scumbags head,and also that the local Skins have Identified this filth and are not claiming the reward.He WILL be dealt with,of that there is no doubt!Boy,did he pick the wrong old lady!

Cheers the spotlight kid.

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