Hoping for some input on a couple knives I inherited

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jash40524
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Hoping for some input on a couple knives I inherited

Post by jash40524 »

My grandpa passed last year, and my grandma gave me a couple of his knives.

I'm primarily interested in learning more about this white handled one, I believe it's bone but could be wrong. I can't find any markings other than what are shown here. I haven't taken either apart, a little afraid to.

the brown one is far smaller, feels cheaper, and has no markings at all.

I can't date either. don't know anything about the brown, but I know the white was originally my great grandfather's. That puts it pre-80s but I suspect it goes a bit further back than that.

White = 9" opened, brown = 7"

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Fishtail Picklock
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Re: Hoping for some input on a couple knives I inherited

Post by Fishtail Picklock »

I believe that the smaller one is a Colonial knife. The larger appears to be from the 1940s-1950s. Its a flat-guard Picklock from Maniago, probably made by one of the larger "cottage" manufacturers. (Francesco/Arturo/Renzo Beltrame).

This is just an educated guess. Bill De Shivs can provide a more definitive answer.

Welcome to the Forum. :D
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Bill DeShivs
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Re: Hoping for some input on a couple knives I inherited

Post by Bill DeShivs »

The brown knife is a Colonial Shur Snap- pre-1058.
The white knife is plastic handled. It was made in Japan in the late 1950s-mid 1960s.
Bill DeShivs, Master Cutler
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Factory authorized repairs for:
Latama, Mauro Mario, LePre, Colonial, Kabar, Flylock, Schrade Cut Co., Presto, Press Button, Hubertus, Grafrath, Kuno Ritter knives.
jash40524
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Re: Hoping for some input on a couple knives I inherited

Post by jash40524 »

I thought about plastic, but figured it was too old... I'm totally uneducated on the topic, though.

I don't really care about monetary value, they're sentimental, but as collectibles go are either worth a hoot, or just run off the mill mass produced/ nothing particularly special?
sammy the blade
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Re: Hoping for some input on a couple knives I inherited

Post by sammy the blade »

Probably worth at least two hoots each.
Fishtail Picklock
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Re: Hoping for some input on a couple knives I inherited

Post by Fishtail Picklock »

Bill DeShivs wrote: Wed Oct 20, 2021 10:20 pm The brown knife is a Colonial Shur Snap- pre-1058.
The white knife is plastic handled. It was made in Japan in the late 1950s-mid 1960s.
Thanks, Bill. I was right about the Colonial Shur-Snap. I should have guessed about the Japanese knife. The filigree on the bail should have been my first clue. Oh, well. Lesson learned.

Those are some nice keepsakes. Put the Japanese knife in a shadow box with a historic know telling of its past and hang it on your wall above your desk. If you are in an auto-friendly jurisdiction, you could put a nice edge on the Shur-Snap and carry it in your change pocket. :wink: :)
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jerryk25
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Re: Hoping for some input on a couple knives I inherited

Post by jerryk25 »

Be very careful with the white Japan. . . .
they are noted for the backspine cracking right at the round locktab.

it is not a "Flat guard". . . . .just because the "ears" look "Flat"
yours has a one-piece stamped bolster, with a formed step, to mimic an old style bolster.

a flat guard has a two piece constructed bolster. (first photo)

a tell-tale way of seeing a flat guard 2 piece construction is a flat part behind the lock-tab. (2nd photo)

also, if both bolsters are viewed from the blade well, or lock tab side,
you can see have they are hand constructed and often do not match up same length. (3rd photo)
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001-flatguard-007xxx.jpg (61.53 KiB) Viewed 732 times
button_man
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Re: Hoping for some input on a couple knives I inherited

Post by button_man »

.

Most old Japanese switchblades are marked "Rizzuto Estileto Milano" and in good working condition sell for around $100+ with the 10+" knives being more saleable than the smaller ones. Since your knife is Japanese and has unusual (non-Rizzuto) markings, it should be worth at least that much, despite the small size. Fortunately, it does not show "blade peek" (blade tip protrudes above the liners when closed) which is all too common on old switchblades.
It should exhibit little or no signs of being sharpened; the safety has to work; it should lock up every time when opened, and have little blade wobble.

Japanese switchblades and stilettos are looked down upon by most serious collectors, although they do have some degree of collectability. I feel they have nowhere to go but up -- nobody has yet written a history or price guide on the Japanese stuff and if /when that happens, collector interest and values will increase.

Your Shur-Snap is shown on page 45 of Mark Erickson's "Antique American Switchblades" and is valued in mint condition at $250. Book values can be much higher or lower than actual marketplace values; and your knife is not mint. Still, it could be worth around $75 to $100. (It would have to meet all of the condition qualifiers described above.) I would recommend that you do NOT sharpen it or carry it. Both of these will greatly reduce any value.
You may be incorrect to say that it shows no markings.... I would swear that I can see the italicized "SHU" of "SHUR-SNAP" on the ricasso.
Underneath that, it should say "COLONIAL" and under that, "PROV USA". Take a look with a magnifying glass.

The more these knives are opened and closed, the faster they will develop blade peek, or (as Jerry says) crack from metal fatigue, or produce other problems. Lightly oil the metal parts (especially the blades) and avoid getting oil on the plastic scales. Store the knives (preferably open) in a dry environment that is not hot or subject to wide temperature fluctuations.

Write down the history of the knives.... the names of your ancestors who owned them, the line of ownership in your family, anything relevant.
Almost nobody does this and when you pass along the knives to the next generation, it would be great if this history was there to provide a link
between the past and the future. Sign and date this history, and keep it with the knives.

Do not be too quick to look down at these knives just because they are not as glamorous as the classic Italian switchblades. At one time, the local
antiques dealers would save old Halloween stuff for me because I was the only person they knew who was interested..... literally nobody else wanted it. The only 'holiday collectors' were people that collected old Christmas stuff; Halloween was scorned as worthless junk. Then around 1993, two totally unconnected people published Price Guides on vintage Halloween stuff a few months apart from each other; and many bookstores started carrying one book or the other. Almost overnight everybody and his Aunt Sally jumped in and prices climbed into the stratosphere. Similarly, many knives currently spurned as "cheap garbage" by advanced collectors are sleepers that may one day become avidly sought. In any event, your knives are great heirlooms
to pass along in the family.

P.S. ~ Does "a couple of his knives" mean that there are MORE? This could be worth looking into.

.
jash40524
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Re: Hoping for some input on a couple knives I inherited

Post by jash40524 »

I appreciate all the info, I did some Googling and thought if anywhere would recognize them it would be here, y'all have not disappointed.

I've got this rifle sized shadow box full of stuff that was his, much of it originally his father in law's. An old model 1896 38-40 with a serial that places it in the first run produced, it's near mint. Couple old nickel revolvers, railroad grade Elgin pocket watch, so these will both go in it.

I like the idea of writing what history I know of it all and keeping it, thanks for that.

And yeah, there were more knives. So many more knives. Cigar boxes of knives. But, I left quite a bit for my dad and uncle, and his other grandkids & great grandkids. My grandma wanted me to have these two, specifically.

I did end up with an old bayonet and sheath, but it's kinda weird.
Wood grips were replaced with clear plastic, under those are pictures of what looks to be some soldier's parents. They're old old pics, but not anyone in our family, so we think it was a flea market pickup. Gramps loved those.

Thanks for treating a newbie so well, been a lot of places not near as welcoming as this has been.
Fishtail Picklock
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Re: Hoping for some input on a couple knives I inherited

Post by Fishtail Picklock »

Jash,

We all are here to share our interests and have fun. My father, baby brother, and I were sailors. All three of us shared our interests in guns and knives. This Forum is a place to share our interests and knowledge.

Welcome, and enjoy!
Fishtail Picklock
portlandmike
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Re: Hoping for some input on a couple knives I inherited

Post by portlandmike »

The white handled knife is commonly called a JPL or Japanese Picklock ... this is a highly desirable knife for collectors. As others have said it was made in Japan but sold in Mexico as a souvenir. Cool knife !

Mike
sammy the blade
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Re: Hoping for some input on a couple knives I inherited

Post by sammy the blade »

jash40524 wrote: Thu Oct 21, 2021 2:38 pm I appreciate all the info, I did some Googling and thought if anywhere would recognize them it would be here, y'all have not disappointed.

I've got this rifle sized shadow box full of stuff that was his, much of it originally his father in law's. An old model 1896 38-40 with a serial that places it in the first run produced, it's near mint. Couple old nickel revolvers, railroad grade Elgin pocket watch, so these will both go in it.

I like the idea of writing what history I know of it all and keeping it, thanks for that.

And yeah, there were more knives. So many more knives. Cigar boxes of knives. But, I left quite a bit for my dad and uncle, and his other grandkids & great grandkids. My grandma wanted me to have these two, specifically.

I did end up with an old bayonet and sheath, but it's kinda weird.
Wood grips were replaced with clear plastic, under those are pictures of what looks to be some soldier's parents. They're old old pics, but not anyone in our family, so we think it was a flea market pickup. Gramps loved those.

Thanks for treating a newbie so well, been a lot of places not near as welcoming as this has been.
Feel free to post pics. We like guns too!
button_man
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Re: Hoping for some input on a couple knives I inherited

Post by button_man »

.

There is a 9" Japanese picklock up for bid on SD right now.... starting bid is $65. No bids yet but it's early days.
This one has been rescaled in cherrywood. On the plus side, it's much nicer than plastic; on the minus side,
it is no longer in its original state. Do these balance out overall? That's entirely subjective.

Just thought you might want to keep an eye on this auction to gauge market interest / value for JPLs.

https://www.sharperdeals.net/listing/9i ... ock/132686

.
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Bill DeShivs
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Re: Hoping for some input on a couple knives I inherited

Post by Bill DeShivs »

The rehandling on that knife on SharperDeals is an amateur job. No safety and misshapen scales.
Bill DeShivs, Master Cutler
http://www.billdeshivs.com
Factory authorized repairs for:
Latama, Mauro Mario, LePre, Colonial, Kabar, Flylock, Schrade Cut Co., Presto, Press Button, Hubertus, Grafrath, Kuno Ritter knives.
Fishtail Picklock
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Re: Hoping for some input on a couple knives I inherited

Post by Fishtail Picklock »

Bill DeShivs wrote: Fri Oct 22, 2021 6:05 pm The rehandling on that knife on SharperDeals is an amateur job. No safety and misshapen scales.
Hal13 is a good seller, but Bill is right. Someone needs to rescale the knife and install a decent safety. If this suffers the problems described by Jerry, it may not be worth the labor/expense to do so.
Fishtail Picklock
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